roleplay
Latest topics
What are Your Current Plans for Your Character?
October 26th 2017, 10:55 am
DarkGodRasul

Land Of Twilight - A Legend Of Zelda Roleplay
October 22nd 2017, 4:39 pm
Josh Dragovalor

The Infinite; Rick and Morty [Forumotion]
October 21st 2017, 1:37 pm
Guest

Steamhunter
October 20th 2017, 8:25 am
Guest

Dragonball Legacy
October 14th 2017, 5:54 pm
Guest

Staff
Updates
11.1.2017 - Kingdom Hearts RP is now closed. We'd like to thank everyone who invested time on the site for contributing to a wonderful experience which lasted for many years. All stories must eventually end, but while this may seem bittersweet, it can't be stressed enough what a pleasure it was to create and share them with you all. Goodbye everyone.


Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Go down

            
Cap
avatar
Post Count : 22
MAG : 3
I propose we remove Synthesis and GP, to simplify the system dramatically. With the removal of two resources to balance and account for, the singular ability system (Magic) would naturally become less limited and more inclusive, such as magic items, magical constructs, etc. to replace the systems we've lost. This would make the competition between Magic and Physical more distinct, but I don't necessarily feel like one outdoes another, at the current point of balance. We should remove skill trees, the ability to gain elements, replacing them with one or two skills TRULY inherent to your character and static alignments.

Either we need this massive simplification, or we need to move to a story system. As of now, no one is really doing anything, and I suspect it's because that everything keeps changing, and as a result we have an ultimately convoluted system in front of us. I think we should move back towards our roots, fam. No one wants to start something only for it to get changed and disrupted.

So, discuss.

Back to top Go down

            
Belal
avatar
The Eldritch Horror
Post Count : 83
True. Still haven't made anything, because I feel things will change. I've also noticed a lack of activity in members and staff. We have a system, but not enough man power to actively approve anything. And it's complicated so it's hard to learn.

As always, I'm in favor of a story system, but I'm for simplifying it into a one resource, expressive system. Only balance we really need to worry about it broken stuff.

Tbh, I'm just gonna roll with the hits. Prolly only make stuff when the site feels stable. There's def an atmosphere where it doesn't though.

___________________
Darkness | Gravity | Cure | Time
Black Bishop

Back to top Go down

            
Hoshiko
avatar
Site Owner
Post Count : 339
MAG : 5
I think the system is fine as is of this moment, and the changes you proposed are a stylistic choice. However, I personally am not attached to any particular system and prefer one that is the most liked. If the current members of the site are in favor of a story system or a more simplified system, then we can make one last change.

___________________
Darkness | Fire | Gravity | Cure

Back to top Go down

            
Camilia
avatar
Post Count : 40
MAG : 2
I honestly think that the current system is fine. Yeah, its a little difficult to learn, but that difficulty helps prepare newer writers over time, instead of thrusting them into a setting where they have to be constantly worried about people higher up in power than they are, or putting them in a setting where they can just write down whatever the hell they want. To me, this seems like a kind of happy medium between a strictly structured site and a story based site. But, I could be wrong about that. It's just my impression after all.

___________________
Random Quotes:
Felonix: If it exists, it can be fucked

Back to top Go down

            
Nora.
avatar
Post Count : 21
I'm with Belal on not touching anything due to so many changes and I'm mega down for story system c:

Another thing I'd like to point out is that atm this feels like a card game, where you want the better abilities(cards) to be able to beat the other and I get that some people may dig that but I'm not here to be stronger than another person, I'm here to write and enjoy writing but to be able to do that there's this incomplete and confusing system where I can't enjoy RPing until I get these approvals done.

Camilia wrote:Yeah, its a little difficult to learn, but that difficulty helps prepare newer writers over time, instead of thrusting them into a setting where they have to be constantly worried about people higher up in power than they are, or putting them in a setting where they can just write down whatever the hell they want.

I think in this system or any progressive system new writers or new people to the site will have to worry about people more powerful than them, especially here with legacy characters. If we stick with this current system I'd suggest we wipe those and make everyone start fresh so that way characters can interact more easily and create conflicts/friendships that will have progression and purpose rather than having a bunch of people super strong compared to everyone else who just started. As I have a legacy character myself I don't see anyone wanting to RP with my character unless they're at the same level as me hence why I'll probably end up making a newbie character if we don't shift to story system.

As for newer members coming in and writing whatever the hell they want I'm not too phased so long as it aligns with lore and doesn't include god-modding, which as a community we can help moderate or guide people in the right place and staff can come in when necessary.

Basically I'm just saying story system ftw.

___________________
STR 10 / CON 5 / AGI 10 / SYN 5 / MAG 0

Back to top Go down

            
Yukina
avatar
Post Count : 10
Yeah also in the boat of not really doing anything 'cause it feels like it's a bit in limbo, which has also effected the topic I'm in which turned into a fight (damn u nora) and I feel like I can't do anything without having stuff approved.

Obvi also no real secret that I'd much prefer a story system.

I also agree that the legacy character thang is a bit eh, considering none of the characters being made using that system have been used in the past (as far as I can tell) which kind of arbitrarily exacerbates the divide between old and new members, which is my main issue with these kinds of competitive based systems. IDK about you guys, but when I joined the original iteration of this site like ten years ago (holy fuck btw), seeing the users at endgame and starting new seemed like an impossible goal which ultimately led me to spending time on a diff site where users were on a more even playing field.

I know the power gap between starting new and endgame is much, much smaller now which is fine but allowing older members the ability to skip all of that just seems a bit pointless. Although totally understand that it's probably too late to do anything about that now if we stick with the current system because it might be too far gone, but yeah just my opinion.

THAT BEING SAID, if we do keep the current system, I think the simpler the better, so prob agree with Cap's post although disagree with losing the ability to buy elements bc I don't really see the point of removing that option/freedom.

Anyway basically agree with everything Nora said lul.

Back to top Go down

            
Cap
avatar
Post Count : 22
MAG : 3
I am SO for removing the legacy feature. Just a sidenote, i want more contributions from different sources before expanding further.

Back to top Go down

            
Hoshiko
avatar
Site Owner
Post Count : 339
MAG : 5
Sure, I'm okay with removing the legacy feature. It was supposed to be an incentive/sort of reward for older members coming back, but if you guys feel as though we're better off without it.

___________________
Darkness | Fire | Gravity | Cure

Back to top Go down

            
Yukina
avatar
Post Count : 10
If that does happen, I also think the ten years passing thing should just be scrapped and do a proper reset. Considering that no one is really using their old characters anyway, it seems a bit pointless to maintain a story that lacks any real implication in the new canon.

Not to mention that if people did want to reuse old characters, they could just create them again and write the history in.

Back to top Go down

            
Liandry
avatar
The Valkyrie
Post Count : 48
MAG : 5
I'm fairly certain the power disparity won't be fixed with a complete reset considering the old diversion was from older writers that spent a great deal of time on site vs the newer users the that came in with big ideas that wanted to catch up really fast and the older writers just bullying them down for ego/self entitlement issues.

I feel the same will happen again with any kind of reset with us now as the current users and any potential future users trying to join us. So I think its more of a community mind set we have to get across, being more open to other's even completely newer writers, trying not to feel superior over someone else and accept flaws make people more interesting.

That be said I hold no real attachment to any systems or bonuses we have so I'm for anything the rest of you are willing to go through. I just want to role play a story and not measure whos ideas are more important then one anothers meta we've been ingrained in.

___________________
Legacy Character: 24000 words left using
STR 5 | AGI 3 | CON 3 | MAG 5 | SYN 0 || Level 3
Light | Fire | Time | Plant

Back to top Go down

            
Belal
avatar
The Eldritch Horror
Post Count : 83
Legacy is whatever. It won't fix the long term power disparity, only delay it, but it can help character interactions early on.

I'm for a history reset, but I also oppose the multiverse bs. If we do a history reset, keep things within this universe. You can be from other worlds, since we are in KH, but multiverses are convoluted and we'd be better off without them. I understand I may be in the minority, as it permanently removes old characters, but meh.

I like synth though.

___________________
Darkness | Gravity | Cure | Time
Black Bishop

Back to top Go down

            
Olek
avatar
Post Count : 20
I'm with Cap.

Roots >

Except now that we rely on word count instead of post count, things might be way better than they ever were. Was not a fan of GP, tbh. Two inherent skills sound way better than a list of skills too in my honest opinion.

___________________
---
[ (Storage) || Water - T2 ]

Back to top Go down

            
Snaz Laka
avatar
Chimera
Post Count : 30
MAG : -
The thing with Legacy is that I find it so easy to reach end-game that I feel it isn't that big of a deal. I understand power-gaps and what-not, but the amount of time it theoretically takes to reach endgame is suuuper quick compared to any iteration of KH.

I wouldn't have minded not having it in the first place, though. However, I'm not gonna be tight if legacy is removed because pretty much stuff just gets locked until it can be earned again via progression.

Synthesis for me is one of my favorite systems, I definitely disagree with removing it. It adds another thematic choice to character creation and it does not limit people to just magic or being a warrior or both.

I honestly would love a story system, given it has established boundaries and what-not along with reinforcing courtesy. But keeping the system as is seems to be the smart move as we don't really know how the system will negatively affect the community aside from some having difficulty working with it due to their understanding of it. But removing things like Synthesis just removes huge chunks and thematic freedom.


___________________
Sounds like Johnny Depp in Mordecai

Speech code: #999900

Back to top Go down

            
Belal
avatar
The Eldritch Horror
Post Count : 83
If we change it to just magic, there's still a lot of balance issues to look over. Magic used to be ridiculously busted. It would also make summons and forms far more limited, unless we drastically increase the power scale of everything involved.

The old system wasn't balanced at all. And the way this system operates, putting it all under magic would make anything other than hybridization unfun due to how limited you are otherwise.

___________________
Darkness | Gravity | Cure | Time
Black Bishop

Back to top Go down

            
Annalise
avatar
Post Count : 77
MAG : 10
A shift to story system would allow for faster approval times and would only require one thing to be approved, character apps. You cut down the amount of energy it'd take to sift through other apps and can focus on getting people into the action, which it seems the general consensus here is to just write for fun. Progression system seems like a great idea to experiment with, I feel as though right now everyone just wants to interact.

As for power disparities, while it may theoretically be easy to reach end game, I do believe that not everyone will have the time to hop on and complete a topic worth 2,400 words every day. Me personally, I could do it if I had the drive and inspiration to reach end game, however, that's not my goal out of character and nor is it for me in-character.

All in all, I do think a shift to story will boost activity numbers. We already have the numbers and people with the want to do something, but their muse (and likely interest) has been shot due to mechanical and technical complications involving the current system. Never hurts to try it and see what happens, you know?

Anyways, those are my two cents on this whole thing.

___________________
Main Theme: Sensuous Gatherings | Conflict: Sexual Frustration
"Chaos and Freedom are the natural laws for the universe, be it man, woman, demon, or angel. I bind myself by my choices, not to the morality and rules of others."

Back to top Go down

            
Cap
avatar
Post Count : 22
MAG : 3
Annalise wrote:Never hurts to try it and see what happens, you know?

Isn't that how we got into this mess though lol

Back to top Go down

            
Annalise
avatar
Post Count : 77
MAG : 10
No one got anywhere by being scared of making a mess and seeing what would result of a test.

___________________
Main Theme: Sensuous Gatherings | Conflict: Sexual Frustration
"Chaos and Freedom are the natural laws for the universe, be it man, woman, demon, or angel. I bind myself by my choices, not to the morality and rules of others."

Back to top Go down

            
Hoshiko
avatar
Site Owner
Post Count : 339
MAG : 5
Not a fan of simplifying the system because it's also more limiting, something that Snaz touched upon. Having three different systems allows for a wide range of character types and diversity.

As for a story system, while it would be easier to do approvals, since there'd only characters would need to be approved, it doesn't create any incentives for people to continue RPing. Not everybody has a story in mind for their character when they start out, and some people like to just get stronger without setting the pace themselves. There should be some incentive to RP. The alternate solution to this would be having active site plots for members to participate in, which is equally stressful on the staff, if not more due to the creative requirements.

Although, I do think we should get rid of legacies. They are, in retrospect, a misstep on my part. While there will always be a power disparity, with a new system, we should have had a fresh start with all the characters. It would also make approvals easier and also give us time to get used to them as we slowly work our way up.

As for resetting the history, I don't like the idea of it simply due to sentimental reasons. Even if it's irrelevant to current RPs, it's nice to have that history.

___________________
Darkness | Fire | Gravity | Cure

Back to top Go down

            
Kitanai
avatar
Post Count : 33
MAG : 2
Yeah, I - like the other members of Black Bishop - haven't been doing anything in terms of approval because the constant changes.

And I totally agree with Hoshiko; an incentive to RP is necessary. I know this from personal experience as I have watched a site slowly die because the lack of incentive. So having in a way some competitiveness creates an incentive and keeps people coming back.

Back to top Go down

            
Cap
avatar
Post Count : 22
MAG : 3
To be more clear, as my first post was a bit vague.

My proposed system would still draw a distinct line between summons, spells, forms, and synthesis. A 150 MP spell doesn't equal a 150 MP summon. Each different class would have a different scale of power. A 150 MP spell could have x power and/or effect(s), whereas a 150 MP summon would have a scaled duration, statistics, etc.

This would allow people to dedicate to various different archetypes.

Furthermore, let me explain why I propose a reduction of skills. Currently, one has so many that its optimal to have an amount dedicated to preventing your playstyle from being prevented. This counter-heavy meta is inconclusive to constructive character interaction. Limiting them to one, two, or three (and perhaps increasing their potency?) would make counter-based characters more dedicated, niche, and less "splash-able" (a card game term meaning that something can just be thrown into a deck and be viable, even optimal). Ideally, the mentally that the site feels like a card game should be eliminated. By forcing more character dedication towards a playstyle, rather than encouraging the counter-heavy meta, it would be harder for the system to be abused over-all. Even if the potency was raised to compensate the lack of abilities, the lack of quantity would still work to remove this threat.

At least, this is why I proposed these specific changes. I either would like the competitive to be simplified in this aspect (which also benefits newer players and fresh characters) or for the competitive system to be removed. I do agree that incentive to roleplay is good, but this particular iteration is only really understood by those who've been here step-by-step. And even then, some have chosen to remain inactive because of the amount of changes. I did have my hand in these changes, to be fair, but nonetheless they need to be considered.

Back to top Go down

            
Hoshiko
avatar
Site Owner
Post Count : 339
MAG : 5
Then that doesn't really simplify it, in my opinion. There'd still be different systems, there'd be just one resource to use them all, which can be even more confusing because you have to adjust it different based on what you're making.

Eh, I don't think skills are the direct cause of the counter meta, which can be accomplished through any of the systems we have. However, to prevent this, we can go back to making skills passive only, which would allow more diversity as well as less counters.

I haven't found any arguments presented to be particularly convincing, and I'm not inclined to simplify or change to a story system. If down the line, people do not like the system at all or it proves to be too complicated, then we can make adjustments or even a shift to a story system. However, I'd rather not scrap what we have now before it's even truly used.

Skills will be changed to passive only and legacies will be revoked. These will be the last changes on the site for a while.

___________________
Darkness | Fire | Gravity | Cure

Back to top Go down

            
Belal
avatar
The Eldritch Horror
Post Count : 83
Cap's propositions are equally, if not more, complicated to understand than the current system. You can argue that a single resource system will be easier to balance, but that's speculation. As of now, I still prefer the current multi-resource system.

Generally, people who want the story system, or at least the one's I've spoken with, don't understand the need for incentives. The idea directly contradicts why you would implement a story system -- the freedom to write and develop your characters within the established universe. They just want to write, because they enjoy writing. Incentives, especially those that revolve around power, attract the kind of members that rp to play a game. That's a valid way to have fun and enjoy yourself, but that directly contradicts the wants for those who prefer the story system.

My point isn't to convince you to change to the story system, but to let you know, if you're looking for incentives within a story system, we will likely never provide one, as we cannot fathom it. Not to put words in other people's mouths, but this is the general consensus from what I've discussed. The KH franchise is large and overwhelming in this regard.

Also, trying to use site plots as incentives are doubly ew. They usually don't work all that well and are executed poorly, put a lot of thought before implementing any willy-nilly in the current system pls.

___________________
Darkness | Gravity | Cure | Time
Black Bishop

Back to top Go down

            
Cap
avatar
Post Count : 22
MAG : 3
I fail to see how what I said was complicated. Reducing the resources would undoubtedly make it more simple. It would be a matter of looking at a chart equal the MP you would want to spend. Seems far more simple than the current system, but maybe i'm missing something.

Back to top Go down

            
Belal
avatar
The Eldritch Horror
Post Count : 83
Based on what you've written, all abilities and effects in our current system would be the same in your system, except it would fall under 'magic' and require MP.
It might be a bit more difficult to understand conceptually, as 'Magic works like this for spells, BUT like this for synth, BUT like this for summons, BUT like this for forms.'

I wouldn't consider that a deal breaker, but you haven't really sold me on why we should take the time to work on and invest in a new system other than speculative ease of balance. Our current system may not be perfect, but you're not offering a solution worth the effort of implementation.

___________________
Darkness | Gravity | Cure | Time
Black Bishop

Back to top Go down

            
Cap
avatar
Post Count : 22
MAG : 3
If you think that I've only suggested that because of balance, then you have failed to read the original post or completely disagree with me. Maybe I'm over-estimating people, though, and this is just as convoluted, if not more (as you've said). But if it's not selling I'll say no more.

Back to top Go down

            
Sponsored content

Back to top Go down

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Back to top

- Similar topics